Nation Radio - June 23, 2012 Entry Draft Edition

NationRadio
June 24 2012 09:24AM

 

 

The 2012 Entry Draft was a wild one, with an unexpected run on defenders in the top-10, the Jordan Staal and Luke Schenn trades as well as Calgary making the biggest risk/reward pick in the first round. The Nation had no less than five people on the ground in Pittsburgh watching the action and rubbing elbows with scouts and GM's alike. Yesterday, all of them talked to Allan about their takes and experiences.

This is Nation Radio.

Part 1

Dustin Nielsen of the TEAM1260 was also on the ground in Pitts. He starts off the show by sharing his thoughts on the Oilers draft as well as some Oilers trade rumors and a few shots at at Jason Strudwick.

Part 2

In segment two, Thomas Drance of Canucks Army and the Vancouver Sun talks about the Canucks choice of Brendan Gaunce as well as their interesting predilection for picking over-aged players in the draft.

Part 3

Nations Overlord Kent Wilson is up next to talk about who the heck this Mark Jankowski kid is anyways. He also shares some impressions of the draft as a whoie.

Part 4

Allan collects some comments from Stu MacGregor and Jason Gregor on the Oilers draft, possible trade partners for Edmonton as well as rumors about a new coach for the Oil.

Part 5

Robert Cleave of JetsNation (formerly FlamesNation) joins Allan next to discuss Jacob Trouba, the Gustavsson trade and missed opportunities.

Part 6

We end off with comments from Oilers second round pick Mitch Moroz as well as Corey Graham. Corey spoke about Moroz's strengths as a player and his potential impact on the Oilers in the future.

Due to technical difficulties, we currently can't offer the entire show in one giant file. We will attempt to rectify this issue ASAP.

And finally, we would like to remind potential sponsors that we still have some very reasonable advertising packages available on Nation Radio. Please contact Kent Wilson (kent.wilson@gmail.com) for more information.

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NationRadio can be heard live on Saturdays from 12-2 PM on the Team 1260 featuring the explicit sounds of DJ Lowetide and his lineup of Allstar guests.Follow us on Twitter: @itsnationradio
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#1 Lowetide
June 24 2012, 09:32AM
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Our guests brought it yesterday. Gregor was on fire, man he covered a lot of things in our segment. Kent gave an exceptional rundown of the Flames draft and Cleave is interesting even if talking about the weather (we didn't talk about the weather).

Right at the top of the show I asked a question in regard to something James Duthie said at the start of the Friday night coverage. Would love your opinion of Duthie's statement and what it might have meant in regard to Yakupov/Murray debate.

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#2 ubermiguel
June 24 2012, 10:29AM
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RE: Duthie's quote. Politics, either internal or external.

Best case, external politics: management was feeding the media the Murray story hoping CBJ would get spooked and make some sort of deal to make sure the get Murray. Loose lips sink ships and all that, no point in letting more people know than necessary.

Worst case, internal politics: information hoarding is a sign of a bad (i.e.: petty, mean-spirited) organizational culture. Maybe management and scouting are at odds.

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#3 OilDieHard
June 24 2012, 11:14AM
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yup, this is probably one time the Oilers had wished they hadn't won the lottery and had just taken apparently NHL ready d-man Ryan Murray.

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#4 Oilcan
June 24 2012, 01:21PM
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Talking about the Ynadle for MPS and Gagner trade I think its a little bit of an overpayment on the Oilers front I would think they could get a more elite defenseman then that but would Yandle and Hanzal for Gagner and MPS do the trick I think I would do it from an Oilers standpoint but would the Yotes'?

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#5 madjam
June 24 2012, 01:22PM
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Crystal Ball Prediction - SMYTH A FLAME . Once again Smyth leaves us citing contractural differences . On Flames team he plays 1-2nd line duties , while on Oilers he faces basically 3-4 line duties . Not to many other teams have a 1-2 position for a Smyth . I said he was not worth what he wanted the first time he left , and i don't believe he ever played up to subsequent contracts he did sign . We made the right decision back then , and i believe we will make the right decision again by not overpaying him . Adding Yakupov has pretty much sealed Smyth's fate on our club for top line status .

A little forsight here might land us a draft pick or two from Flames for next season - just saying , which is better than nothing ? No contract as yet accepted by Smyth and today a good day to start fast tracking to trade him . Iginla and Banff would be attractive to SMYTH lets not kid ourselves .

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#6 Kent Wilson
June 24 2012, 01:32PM
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@madjam

LW is the one area Flames have depth this year. Tanguay, Glencross, Cammalleri (if he doesn't play center) and Baertschi.

I dont see Smyth coming here as a result.

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#7 Pouzar99
June 24 2012, 01:54PM
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I agree Smyth signing with the Flames as a real possibility as once again Meehan is demanding more than he is worth and Smytty wants to live in Alberta. He would prefer Edmonton for obvious reasons but his agent only cares about his 10 per cent. Meehan made good dough when Smytty left Edmonton but his client was in tears. If Oilers refuse to meet Meehan's demands and Calgary does he will go there and I will wish him well. He can still help a team and Calgary is playing for now. Edmonton is still playing the long game, although the next eight days will determine if management is shooting for the playoffs.

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#8 D
June 24 2012, 02:25PM
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LT,

I believe this entire weekend (and James Duthie's comment) should be looked upon from the eyes of the owner. If the Oilers had not won the lottery, then the draft would have unfolded like it did during the last few years. The minute the Oilers won the lottery, it threw all of management's plans into disarray. Having run a small company, I can tell you that when management gets thrown a curve-ball such as winning the lottery, the owner (especially someone as successful as Katz) WILL step in.

I have consistently believed that Katz's business model is the 1980s Oilers. It should come as no surprise that the current team's defense has been neglected in favour of offense. So when the scouts come to management and say "we should draft Murray," the management would probably have gone in that direction. But Katz likely stepped in and said, no. From a business perspective, Yakupov is the best bet even though it keeps the Oilers unbalanced. Yakupov also fits into Katz's mindset of turning the Oilers into an offensive juggernaut.

So now that the owner stepped in and overrode his scouts (and possibly his management) - what does a good owner do? Remember, the owner has to send a signal that he values his staff. The quickest way is to tell the staff that anything goes for the remaining draft picks. The scouts get whatever they want, no matter how much heat it creates. That would explain the Moroz pick.

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#9 vetinari
June 24 2012, 02:35PM
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Initially, I was slightly disappointed when they took Moroz instead of a guy like Thrower. However, if Zhirkov would have been taken at 32 and we landed Moroz at his pick, I would have been fine with everything. I guess the result is let's re-evaluate this draft in three to five years. Good coverage at the draft guys!

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#10 Dextermorgan
June 24 2012, 02:38PM
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This team will somehow, someway find a way to screw with Ryan Smyth. This organization is crap.

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#11 Quicksilver ballet
June 24 2012, 03:56PM
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The Oilers set the benchmark on this Smyth type value issue themselves. Why aren't they adhering to it on this Smyth contract?

If Horcoff and Hemsky are worth 5 and 6 million respectively, why isn't Smyth worth close to that? Ryan put more points up on the board, played as many or more minutes and stayed healthy.

It's really silly to see the Oilers squishing Smyth under their hush puppies when they offer up SHIP contracts like this to Horcoff and Hemsky.

I'm not saying Smyth is worth anything near 4-5 million per season but where was this financial management when the Hemsky and Horcoff contracts where passed out? WTF are those bozos doing....

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#12 Reg Dunlop
June 24 2012, 04:32PM
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At best Smyth is quickly fading to 3rd line effectiveness, but he is resisting the diminished role. Resistance is futile. Hemsky is a few years away from fading so he is worth more, Horcoff I guess we are stuck with.

Please, Ryan, accept the contract offer,be a good team player in a 3rd line/ mentor role, retire in a few years as an Oiler and then become a part of management so I can critisize your every decision.

Regarding the Moroz pick, even though 2nd rounders face 1 in 10 chances of making the show, what in the world were they doing? Inexcusable to leave 1st round rated talent, especially talent at centre and defence like Sissons and Sutter, Finn and Thrower. Picking fireplugs is fine but overvaluing them as high round 2 picks is a bad idea.

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#13 Dextermorgan
June 24 2012, 04:42PM
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Reg, this team has been dead last for the last 3 years for a reason.

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#14 madjam
June 24 2012, 04:56PM
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Don't assume Horcoff safe , or Gagner if he's asking a ransom like Smyth . Al 3 could be on the outs along with Hemsky by trade deadline . The Hemsky pay has created a monster for us overpaying for non elite talent ! When we get rid these ridulous contracts even it it has to be a buyout , we'll be far better off when it comes to performing personnel and giving acceptable contracts to our emerging youth . Thats a priority as far as i am concerned , as it's holding back (retarding ) our move forward .We are in an unhealthy position even worse if we overpay Gagner and Smyth as well . Time to bite the bullet now before our youth demands soar as well . Gagner's value outside Oilers unfortuneately may only be close to O'Marks which we could not even give away for draft picks of any sort this year . Gagner is small and not physical or defensive enough to garner much value outside the Oilers . We over value Gagner simply put .

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#15 Chri
June 24 2012, 06:37PM
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madjam wrote:

Don't assume Horcoff safe , or Gagner if he's asking a ransom like Smyth . Al 3 could be on the outs along with Hemsky by trade deadline . The Hemsky pay has created a monster for us overpaying for non elite talent ! When we get rid these ridulous contracts even it it has to be a buyout , we'll be far better off when it comes to performing personnel and giving acceptable contracts to our emerging youth . Thats a priority as far as i am concerned , as it's holding back (retarding ) our move forward .We are in an unhealthy position even worse if we overpay Gagner and Smyth as well . Time to bite the bullet now before our youth demands soar as well . Gagner's value outside Oilers unfortuneately may only be close to O'Marks which we could not even give away for draft picks of any sort this year . Gagner is small and not physical or defensive enough to garner much value outside the Oilers . We over value Gagner simply put .

huh?

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#16 Wanyes bastard child
June 24 2012, 06:42PM
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Chri wrote:

huh?

Chri, meet madjam, he either grows on you or you learn to skip past his comments ;)

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#17 Will
June 24 2012, 07:28PM
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I think maybe Tambillini's Timeline was a little longer than the fans and the media. There is no argument that we have elite scoring talent: Eberle, Nuge, Hall, Yak, (And to a lesser extent Gagner and Hemsky). 6 skill players. Great. Other than maybe Hemsky and possibly Gags if he gets traded, thats skill that'll be in the line-up for a long time. 4 high end skill players is a lot for any NHL team.

We also have a lot of depth at Defense as 11 players are developing near the point of being NHL ready and being good NHL players. But in both cases, a year or two of development will be needed. So we no longer need to draft high end skill, or high end defense (unless it's available and can't pass it up) so now we have the luxury of drafting excellent role players (skill and size, good pk and pp players, etc).

The team is in a great spot, made great picks, don't think we'll make the playoffs this year, but our future just keeps getting brighter and brighter as we now turn to shoring everything up and getting the team polished into a cup contender.

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#18 Stupendous Man
June 24 2012, 08:05PM
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I've assumed for awhile that Lowe's/Tambellini's reputation with other GMs was bad/strained -- but the inability this past weeekend to execute a type of trade (trading up into the later stages of the first round) that we've seen numerous times in recent drafts underscores to me how bad the situation has gotten. Not only are there several GMs who've taken issue with some of the moves (offer sheets, Smyth/Fraser trade) this regime has pulled in recent years -- Lowe/Tambellini also have the stigma of finishing 30th/30th/29th and, in Lowe's case, icing the worst team since the lockout.

If I'm a rival GM, there's no way I'm making a trade with this group that resembles fair value. I'm insisting on an overpay from the Oilers, because it's too much of a risk to my personal reputation to chance being bested by the current Oilers' brass. This might explain the Gilbert-Schultz trade and Dean Lombardi's seeming overreaction to how the Smyth/Fraser trade went down last year -- even though the hockey world knew he was in a no-win situation.

It appears Lowe/Tambellini have "lost the room" -- the "room" being their peers.

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#19 abbeef
June 24 2012, 10:42PM
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Stupendous Man wrote:

I've assumed for awhile that Lowe's/Tambellini's reputation with other GMs was bad/strained -- but the inability this past weeekend to execute a type of trade (trading up into the later stages of the first round) that we've seen numerous times in recent drafts underscores to me how bad the situation has gotten. Not only are there several GMs who've taken issue with some of the moves (offer sheets, Smyth/Fraser trade) this regime has pulled in recent years -- Lowe/Tambellini also have the stigma of finishing 30th/30th/29th and, in Lowe's case, icing the worst team since the lockout.

If I'm a rival GM, there's no way I'm making a trade with this group that resembles fair value. I'm insisting on an overpay from the Oilers, because it's too much of a risk to my personal reputation to chance being bested by the current Oilers' brass. This might explain the Gilbert-Schultz trade and Dean Lombardi's seeming overreaction to how the Smyth/Fraser trade went down last year -- even though the hockey world knew he was in a no-win situation.

It appears Lowe/Tambellini have "lost the room" -- the "room" being their peers.

Or instead of making crazy conspiracy theories we could just think logically.

1) They didn't trade up into the later stages of the first round because they either didn't want to or the price was higher than they liked.

2) I would explain the Gilbert/Schultz trade as a good hockey trade that made the team better.

3) If everyone thinks that they are so bad then people should be lining up to trade with them as they 'know' they will be able to win every trade.

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#20 Drinkin' the Oilaid
June 24 2012, 11:22PM
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re: Duthie's comments.

Why are we assuming that somehow mgmt overruled the scouts' recommendation for the first pick? Maybe the scouts "didn't know who the pick would be" because they didn't know whether the Oil was picking first. The scouts wouldn't need to know if the pick was moving, simply that it was possible. The Oilers might have even decided to accept an offer only to have the reciprocating team pull the trade offer.

There were so many moving pieces, we'll never really know what happened. I find it very hard to believe that the Oil would follow their scouts for two years only to bail on their scouts this year. This simply speaks to how difficult this draft was due to the circumstances. It's now up to the player development group to maximize the potential in these picks.

Now, when mgmt announces that they've finished dragging their feet on the headcoaching situation only to grab the guy who stood next to Renney all year, that's a decision that CAN be questioned. If Ralph was truly that special, why the heck would it take so long?

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#21 madjam
June 25 2012, 10:57AM
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Drafting is easy with Oilers Nation helping Oilers out with their picks . Why bother with scouts when you have so many in Oilers Nation ? Oilers Nation , the pulse of the Oilers , and it's free to boot ..

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#22 aeiouY
June 25 2012, 01:45PM
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can u please get the most recent nation radio broadcast up on iTunes

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#23 Stupendous Man
June 25 2012, 10:32PM
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@ abbeef

You're right, of course. This is just a theory.

Your point about the price for moving up into the later stages of the first round possibly being higher than they liked is exactly what I'm trying to get at here. I'm not so sure Tambellini is as bad at making trades as the average fan seems to think he is. I think it's more of a case of not getting the same opportunities as other GMs because of the recent history of this franchise.

I'm not a fan of his work, but I think even Tambellini knows the difference between a fair trade and an overpay -- and even though the Oilers appear to be telling the hockey world that things are going according to plan and Tambellini's job is safe, his peers aren't letting him off the hook, knowing that the pressure in this market to start winning now is getting intense.

So, in my opinion, Tambellini is now continually faced with the dilemma of either standing pat or forcing a trade that he knows is an overpay to fill a need.

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